calderdale appeals process

[rangeroy]

Hi all, this is my first post on here so if its in the wrong section i apologise!
i have attatched the letter that explains how if you dont agree with your JE outcome you can lodge an appeal (ha)
on this basis i have done a quick pro forma reply that other people can use (or not), i am a member of unison but they have not been forth coming with any help as yet (IMHO) but i hope to try & get some meeting with a rep sorted next week.
the doc's are as attatched
cheers rangeroy

[johnfricker]

Hello rangeroy

The NJC guidance on appeals may be found on page 157 (Adobe Reader page numbering) of the Green Book (www.leicester.gov.uk/your-council--serv ... green-book. Note in particular paragraph 6.4: Re-evaluations should be conducted using the computerised version. A freshly completed JDQ (or part thereof) should be used. It may also be advisable for a different (trained) person to conduct the interview. Page 151 onwards gives general guidance on the computerised NJC scheme.

Have the unions agreed to the grounds of appeal being restricted? How are you supposed to demonstrate that your job has been allocated the wrong job type? What guidance and information has been provided to help you? The Green Book suggests other grounds. For instance, there is this in paragraph 5.4 on page 156: This is important because a grounds for appeal is that the JDQ did not provide complete information. Paragraph 2.1.1 on page 177 suggests other grounds.

I think you should register an appeal, but be prepared for it to be rejected if it doesn't meet the criteria. I would be tempted to register a grievance on the grounds that your job overview is three years old and no longer accurate, that Green Book guidance has not been followed in that a fresh JDQ has not been prepared and the computerised scheme will not be used for re-evaluations. Also that the grounds for appeal are more restricted than Green Book guidance suggests. If guidance and information required for you to assess your job type hasn't been provided, that might also be grounds for a grievance. Make it absolutely clear that it is a grievance so they can't treat it as an appeal and reject it because it doesn't meet the grounds for appeal.

Good luck - John

[rangeroy]

Hi again, cheers for that info it looks useful, still no contact from unison
one problem with the info from the hr dept was that we have only been given a overall total score so it's impossible to target any section of the job overview, hence going for a pro forma scatter gun approach to the appeal process.
I did put in for all details to be released under the FOI template off this site but it was rejected on the grounds that it would take 37hrs to collate & take the cost over the max allowed to charge!!

[johnfricker]

...one problem with the info from the hr dept was that we have only been given a overall total score......I did put in for all details to be released under the FOI template off this site but it was rejected on the grounds that it would take 37hrs to collate

The following is from page 66 (Adobe reader numbering) of the Green Book:
3.3 Following the local grading review, all employees will have to be notified of their grade and appropriate pay point(s). In addition, individuals should be provided with the results of the evaluation of their jobs, on request, setting out the points scored under each factor.
Another departure from Green Book guidance to add to a grievance I would suggest, rangeroy. You may also wish to find out your council's FoI complaints procedure and challenge their refusal to provide factor scores, asking them to explain and justify the strangely precise 37 hours given as grounds for refusal. You have to go through the complaints procedure before complaining to the Information Commissioner.

Keep us informed - John

[rangeroy]

asked for full factor breakdown & recived following reply from HR dept (note did'nt even get my surname correct!!) & took a full week to reply


From: Chris Yates
Sent: 07 September 2009 12:38
To: Roy Johnson
Cc: Andrew King
Subject: RE: factor breakdown


Dear Mr Johnston,

As explained to you at the Job Evaluation drop-in session at Todmorden on 19 August ’09, no individual factor breakdowns are being supplied.

Regards, Chris Yates

HR and Change.



From: Roy Johnson
Sent: 01 September 2009 13:32
To: Job Evaluation
Subject: factor breakdown



Hi, can you send my my full factor breakdown for my post as community ranger.

cheers

[rangeroy]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Chris Yates
Sent: 09 September 2009 16:54
To: Roy Johnson
Cc: Andrew King
Subject: RE: factor breakdown


Mr. Johnson,

The advice in the Green Book is guidance on this matter. The line taken by the Council is that no individual factor scores are to be sent out to individuals – any appeals are against allocation to ‘wrong job type’ rather than grade determined for the job.

Chris.

From me to the above

RE: factor breakdown

Thank you for replying so promptly & for getting my name correct!! So the advice in the green book is for guidance only
rather than a code?? I think you may have been watching too much of the 'Pirates of the Caribbean' films.
rangeroy.

[johnfricker]

Hello rangeroy

I think it is time to make a formal FoI request to your council's Acting Information Management Co-ordinator, Tracie Robinson, email tracie.robinson@calderdale.gov.uk . Not to your evasive HR people. Perhaps mention the Green Book guidance and these cases: http://www.itspublicknowledge.info/Uplo ... 2-2009.pdf ; http://www.ico.gov.uk/upload/documents/ ... 078603.pdf

If you still don't get the information within 20 working days, details of how to complain may be found here:
http://www.calderdale.gov.uk/council/ac ... dback.html .

As the council imposed deadline will have passed by the time your FoI request has been dealt with, I think you should also submit a grievance that the council has failed to provide information essential to the preparation of an appeal against your evaluated grade and that you should be granted the right to submit a further appeal within 28 days from the date of such information being provided in accordance with your FoI request.

Good luck - John

[chianti]

Rangeroy - what a farce eh! At least we got a factor breakdown for the grade they had assessed us on. I managed to get an appeal hearing on 3 factors. But am not counting my chickens before they are hatched. Will know the result within 10 days after the hearing.

[rangeroy]

sent this letter in lets see what happens

[johnfricker]

Good luck, rangeroy.

Don't forget to submit a formal written complaint in accordance with your council's FoI complaints procedure if you don't receive a satisfactory response within 20 working days. Take it up with the Information Commissioner if you don't get a response to the complaint after 10 working days.

Regards - John

[rangeroy]

this gets better, according to the Hr dept they took the decision not the council as first said
read as follows

From: Roy Johnson
Sent: 18 September 2009 12:05
To: Chris Yates
Subject: RE: factor breakdown



Hi Chris, could you point me to the line that has been taken by the Council that states no individual factor scores are to be sent to individuals??

I have asked & looked & can find no records of this!! so can you show me any emails, faxes or minutes from meetings by the Council that show that the Council are taking the line of no factor scores are to be sent to individuals.

thanks

RE: factor breakdown

Mr. Johnson,

This decision was taken by the Job Evaluation Team – it would have been impossible for Elected Members to be involved in the myriad of decisions/judgements relating to JE.

Thanks, Chris

[johnfricker]

- it would have been impossible for Elected Members to be involved in the myriad of decisions/judgements relating to JE.

That is probably true, rangeroy. Most of them wouldn't understand anyway. However, they should have been told that the council was departing from Green Book guidance by limiting the information provided to jobholders. Particularly if this departure from good practice potentially exposes the council to equal pay claims. Perhaps sympathetic councillors should be informed.

Good luck - John

[rangeroy]

Hi all, here we go again,
yesterday on returning from work my partner had a letter from the H/R dept stating that Her appeal was not valid due to arriving at their office on 11th sept & the cut off date was the 10th sept .

The original letter giving Her the JE grade was dated the 3rd of Aug & it stated that people had 30 days after reciept of letter to get appeal in, (stay with it) as it happens, we were both in France & our mail was been held by the PO until the 7th of Aug.
Now back to the letter, it states that firstly you must discuss any appeal with your line manager before putting in a formal request, my partners manager is a Headmistress of a J&i school & was not available to speak to until the end of the summer hols (2nd Sept) also as I am sure people are aware the first few days back after summer break can be chaotic especially in a school with new intake & children in new classes etc.
I had over the summer brought this fact both to unison & the H/R dept & the H/R dept assured me & Unison that It would not be a problem, however when spoken to today they insist that enough time was given.
I have spoken to Unison tonight & have a meet next week to formulate a grievance.
cheers for your patience & any ideas anyone may have on this

[rangeroy]

Recieved this late today (see attatchment), on the stage 3 I am fairly sure that there was no trade union official involved (but I need to check).
Also all appeals to be allowed with restriction on date now up to 25th sept
I am still on with greivence against H/R dept, first draft sent back to Unison for amendments .

Big up to all on this forum who have been of great help, even people who just read the posts show a need for communication

thanks again rangeroy

[johnfricker]

I cannot understand, rangeroy, why the evaluation wasn't left at Stage 2 (moderation jointly undertaken by Head of Service, Trade Union representative and Job Analyst). Surely your Head of Service knows your job best and the Job Analyst was the best person to advise on the appropriate Factor Levels. I should have thought that the Job Evaluation Team representative and Management representative involved in the Stage 3 final moderation would be less competent to award Factor Levels. If the 417 points awarded at Stage 2 would have placed your job within Scale 4, I think you are entitled to know on what basis the Stage 3 moderators reduced the relevant factor levels. I also think you are entitled to be provided with a copy of the minutes of both the Stage 2 and Stage 3 panels' deliberations. I know jobs with the same title vary between councils, but Scale 4 seems to be the minimum grade for Community Ranger elsewhere if you do some Googling.

I'm not clear about what Stage 1 involved. Was the interview carried out by somebody merely inputting your answers to questions prompted by the software? Playing devil's advocate, most jobholders would 'over-egg the pudding' if this were the case.

Now you have the Factor Levels, you could look (as detached and objectively as possible) at all of Part 4.1 Appendix 1 of the Green Book to see what the Levels awarded to your job mean and if they are fair. I really think it is totally wrong that you are being denied the right to challenge Levels separately.

I wonder if anyone else whose job has been evaluated using the same scheme and software could comment on the moderation process.